8th Edition

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Re: 8th Edition

Postby tinfoil » Thu Jun 29, 2017 11:57 am

I also really really like the way vehicles and large gribblies weaken as they absorb wounds.
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Re: 8th Edition

Postby Thunderjaw » Tue Jul 04, 2017 8:47 am

Hey Fred... what "points level" did you play at? And by points level I mean did you actually use points or play with the more simplified power levels, and what value for them?

The points in this edition are a real bitch to use, so PL seems like a much simpler way to make a list. I'm going to post two I was looking at in the 150PL range over in the lists forum. Let's have some conversation!
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Re: 8th Edition

Postby tinfoil » Tue Jul 04, 2017 2:26 pm

We played with the simplified power levels, at total power levels of (IIRC) 80.

One question did arise, which was, how to account for blue horror/brimstone splitting? Everything I summoned I "paid for" via my 80 points. But because the simplified system counts via units and not via models, we weren't sure how to handle the arrival of blue horrors model by model. Jack posited that the potential for splitting may be already accounted for in the power level cost, so we played it that way -- although after I ran out of models (after 4 or so pinks had split into 8 or so blues), I just stopped splitting.
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Re: 8th Edition

Postby Thunderjaw » Tue Jul 04, 2017 4:43 pm

I'd agree with Jack that it's built into the cost already. If the PL doesn't quibble about things like Heavy Weapons and power fists, then I'm guessing it's cool with Horrors splitting.
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Re: 8th Edition

Postby afeinman » Wed Jul 05, 2017 10:14 am

Alright, I ordered the main book. Should be here next week some time...
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Re: 8th Edition

Postby mace_ace » Wed Jul 05, 2017 11:21 am

Fred, for what it's worth the cost of the blues and brimstone are factored into the cost of the Pink Horrors for AoS. It makes sense that it would be the same for 8th ed since they use the same summoning methods.
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Re: 8th Edition

Postby Thunderjaw » Wed Jul 05, 2017 11:30 am

The two rules that really jump out to me as game changers are these:

1. Anyone can wound anything with the roll of a 6. While this means things like wraithlords are now vulnerable to ST4 models, the real impact comes with all vehicles having wounds. That means that your space marines can blast a Land Raider with their boltguns. One round of hot rolls and bad saves will see big things gone that never would have been touched previously.

2. Morale MATTERS. The new test version is that each squad that takes casualties rolls a D6 and adds the Cas count to the roll. If it's over their morale they lose the difference in guys. And you take that test every time you take casualties. There's no more "winning combat". Everyone tests. Even if you wipe out your opponent you're testing. I'm developing the opinion that this is going to make MSU slightly more favored... i.e. take 3 units of 10 rather than one of 30. For elite armies it won't really change anything.
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Re: 8th Edition

Postby mace_ace » Wed Jul 05, 2017 11:31 am

Codexes soon!

https://www.warhammer-community.com/201 ... ge-post-2/

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Re: 8th Edition

Postby afeinman » Wed Jul 05, 2017 12:12 pm

Thunderjaw wrote:The two rules that really jump out to me as game changers are these:

1. Anyone can wound anything with the roll of a 6. While this means things like wraithlords are now vulnerable to ST4 models, the real impact comes with all vehicles having wounds. That means that your space marines can blast a Land Raider with their boltguns. One round of hot rolls and bad saves will see big things gone that never would have been touched previously.


Yikes. I kinda liked the "our weapons are useless!" aspect. This means everything maxxes out at, like T6?

Thunderjaw wrote:2. Morale MATTERS. The new test version is that each squad that takes casualties rolls a D6 and adds the Cas count to the roll. If it's over their morale they lose the difference in guys. And you take that test every time you take casualties. There's no more "winning combat". Everyone tests. Even if you wipe out your opponent you're testing. I'm developing the opinion that this is going to make MSU slightly more favored... i.e. take 3 units of 10 rather than one of 30. For elite armies it won't really change anything.


So...everything's a 3rd-edition demon squad now? Youch. How does that interact with things like Boyz checking squad size?
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Re: 8th Edition

Postby mace_ace » Wed Jul 05, 2017 12:23 pm

Orks and Tyranids have ways to help limit the effects of morale.

And Brad, maybe this is what you meant, but you don't take a morale test every time you take wounds, but rather during the morale phase at the end of the turn. So that, if you took wounds at all during that phase, by any source, you then take one morale test for the turn.
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Re: 8th Edition

Postby Thunderjaw » Wed Jul 05, 2017 3:39 pm

Good Correction. That's sort of what I meant, but didn't articulate clearly. In the old edition you could kill half my marines, but if I "won combat" I didn't test. In this edition we'll BOTH test and I'll probably lose more guys. Cool dynamic, but will take getting used to...
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Re: 8th Edition

Postby 92acclude » Fri Jul 07, 2017 12:21 pm

afeinman wrote:
Thunderjaw wrote:The two rules that really jump out to me as game changers are these:

1. Anyone can wound anything with the roll of a 6. While this means things like wraithlords are now vulnerable to ST4 models, the real impact comes with all vehicles having wounds. That means that your space marines can blast a Land Raider with their boltguns. One round of hot rolls and bad saves will see big things gone that never would have been touched previously.


Yikes. I kinda liked the "our weapons are useless!" aspect. This means everything maxxes out at, like T6?

Most big stuff looks to be maxing out around T7-T8, but there's stuff out there that's tougher

Thunderjaw wrote:2. Morale MATTERS. The new test version is that each squad that takes casualties rolls a D6 and adds the Cas count to the roll. If it's over their morale they lose the difference in guys. And you take that test every time you take casualties. There's no more "winning combat". Everyone tests. Even if you wipe out your opponent you're testing. I'm developing the opinion that this is going to make MSU slightly more favored... i.e. take 3 units of 10 rather than one of 30. For elite armies it won't really change anything.


So...everything's a 3rd-edition demon squad now? Youch. How does that interact with things like Boyz checking squad size?


Boyz leadership is their squad size... unless of course the unit has been decimated and it's under that. Units can also share leadership values within 6 inches. Which is pretty cool.
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Re: 8th Edition

Postby Thunderjaw » Fri Jul 07, 2017 1:00 pm

Yeah, what Dylan said... there's still stuff out there that's high toughness, but you'll basically ALWAYS be able to wound it with anything. The "real toughness" comes when you get things that are Toughness 8 with a 2+ save that rerolls fails or something like that... Or regens wounds. Basically they seem to have scattered traditionl toughness across a broader spectrum of stats.


On Leadership... here's an example.


A Squad of marines (10 men) lose a single model taking them to 9. They now have to take a test when they previously didn't have to. So they roll a D6 and add the number of casualities. In this case let's say they roll the worst possible: a 6. Plus the one casualty they're at 7. Since their LD is probably 8/9 they're perfectly fine. But if they'd taken 2-3 casualties they might be losing a guy. In the past they'd of been completely unaffected. Now, not so much.

Now take Orks... 30 boyz take 10 casualties. Their LD is now literally 20. They roll a D6 (again a 6) and add 10... they're at 16 and perfectly fine. No loses. But a squad of 10 that loses 5 boyz rolls a 6 adds the 5 casualties and now they're losing 3-4 more models due to morale. That's fairly huge. I'm undecided if taking 3 squads of 10 makes more sense than 1 squad of 30.
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Re: 8th Edition

Postby Living_Host » Fri Jul 07, 2017 2:57 pm

afeinman wrote:Dammit.

How likely am I to get Danger Planet opening up in my town again?


Well, I'm still playing the PowerBall twice a week. It's definitely on the list of stuff that'll be considered if I win 8)

Glad to hear so much positive buzz about 8th Ed. I'm hoping to get my first game in this weekend. One of the things that I'm most looking forward to doing is being able to field my old armies again. Keeping up with the 7th Ed was spendy so I pretty much stuck with my Blood Angels. With the new release I picked up the various indexes and it's awesome to think about having all of my old stuff available again.

Looking forward to seeing what they do with the codices when they come out.

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Re: 8th Edition

Postby NobleSavage » Fri Jul 07, 2017 3:47 pm

I'm delighted to see both challenges and "Look out, sir!" gone.
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