Standish Standoff III

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Re: Standish Standoff III

Postby tinfoil » Sun Nov 24, 2013 2:26 pm

Frickin' awesome day, Steve and Crossroaders! I'm so glad I went up there! I had two great games, one kinda weird one in the middle, but hey, it's all good. It was great seeing so many of our Maine-iac brothers.

And wow, there were numerous gorgeous models/conversions/armies up there. Every time I get up there the armies get prettier and weirder. Very inspiring.

Next time I vow to have new models, finished models, and yet more grotesque creations.

Greenstuff for the Greenstuff God!
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Re: Standish Standoff III

Postby Lucyth » Sun Nov 24, 2013 3:09 pm

It was a very fun day! It was nice to see the Maine group in their element and I REALLY like that store a lot! Very fun!

The only complaint I have is what Mason said: the comp score has some loopholes for abusive lists to walk through. It's a bummer I had to run into one, but we already talked about that while I was there. (though I'm pretty happy that kid didn't win any prizes with that list)

I hope to make it to the next Standoff and if Dylan goes to the Spring event, then I'll probably tagging along too!

Great success!
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Re: Standish Standoff III

Postby stormboy » Sun Nov 24, 2013 3:27 pm

As always, love the store and play space.

I had two awesome games - one against an army I thought I had no chance against (IA Tank Company) and Monster centered Tyrranids. The third game sucked the fun out of the entire day. I didn't expect to meet a list that was designed to make my presence at the table unnecessary.

But the comp system has some holes when Tigerius leads (Blood Angel painted but Ultramarine played) marines fistbumping with Tau (Blue Tau using the special rules from the Farsight). The comp system allowed to many loop holes that were exploited via allies. Rather than the focus on slot choices, maybe next time you can try to rein back the allies abuses instead of changing around the force org chart. Also, WYSIWYG should have some enforcement. After the last game I am pretty down on the event, to be honest. If someone brings Blood Angel models they should need to use Blood Angel rules - things like that raise my hackles.

I will stop my rant now and try to let go of the frustration.
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Re: Standish Standoff III

Postby Brutal Legend » Sun Nov 24, 2013 3:38 pm

I'll just echo the common elements of everybody's comments so far. The event was large, the venue was nice (the meat locker room in the back was really cold in the morning), and the majority of my 3 opponents were good people.

I too want to back up the claim about the comp system. The system forced me to adjust my forces to get a maximum comp score and going into the event I was expecting your comp system to really put a leash on spam and WAAC lists. From my direct experience with my opponents, I saw some minimal troop squad sizes, vehicle squadron abuse, and unit spamming. This was some player's way of fulfilling column 1 to get to column 2 and then onto column 3. So, in the end you could still wiggle your way through to get an "unfun" list.

My worst game was against the guy with the Deathwing army with 25 models and 3 landraiders (excuse me, 2 landraiders and a landraider Spartan). Luckily my army proved to be more flexible and able to complete the mission objectives, because he sat his whole army in his deployment zone for 3 turns and had his arms crossed like he was saying "ha ha, go ahead and try to kill armor 14 boxes ha ha ha". Ok, so some of the landraiders counted as transports. His comp crossed a line for me there. And of course he started to get all pissy when I shoved some melta bombs up his ass and turned the tables on him.

But, hey, I'll try not too let it get me down.
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Re: Standish Standoff III

Postby Exokan » Sun Nov 24, 2013 3:53 pm

I thought I typed a response....

I luckily had a good day with three great opponents... all with nice lists, casual and friendly demeanor, and no hint of social awkwardness. I got creamed two games in a row, but thoroughly enjoyed every match up.

I'll plan on coming up for the spring event. Hopefully it'll be 1500p... so I can bring something silly.
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Re: Standish Standoff III

Postby SRM » Sun Nov 24, 2013 6:21 pm

I unfortunately had two bad games and one alright one. The same three Land Raider guy that Brutal Legend played provided me with a merely okay game of 40k, although three Land Raiders seemed pretty abusive of the comp system. The dude seemed like an alright enough guy though. My second game was against some Necron player where I might as well have left my models on their display board and dice in their box. I didn't get to do anything and he was a real pain in the ass about rules that don't normally matter (you're going to make me roll individually for each model in my Imperial Guard squads as they go through dangerous terrain? Really?) and we needed a judge twice to solve rules problems that had never, ever been problems for me before. I lost 31 to 1. I won 31 to 1 in the next game against the kid who had Orks and a bad cold. He was a nice enough kid, but the game itself was a massacre. I can say with pride that I beat up a sick kid.

Regardless, you've got a great store there and it sounds like most people had pretty good games! I really wish I could've played Marcello and his awesome Iron Warriors, but maybe next time. Thanks for running the tournament, I hope to be there and have a little more luck with who I play next time!
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Re: Standish Standoff III

Postby TheRhino » Sun Nov 24, 2013 7:08 pm

I'll post a longer response later, but the spring event will definitely be 1500 points.
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Re: Standish Standoff III

Postby DAPatrick » Sun Nov 24, 2013 7:10 pm

Sounds like the comp system didn't really work out too well. As I have said before, I think trying to comp lists and allow allies will never work out. Any thoughts on how it could have been improved?
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Re: Standish Standoff III

Postby Lucyth » Sun Nov 24, 2013 8:08 pm

TheRhino wrote:I'll post a longer response later, but the spring event will definitely be 1500 points.


THIS. I am definitely looking forward to this. Narrative Event? 1500? YES PLEASE.

DAPatrick wrote:Sounds like the comp system didn't really work out too well. As I have said before, I think trying to comp lists and allow allies will never work out. Any thoughts on how it could have been improved?


I think there are a few easy way to solve a lot of issues:

1) a heavy penalty for bringing two or more special characters. Doubly so if one is from an allies detachment.

2) a penalty for bringing allies that are not Battle Brothers

3) a heavy penalty to be assessed by Event Organizers at their discretion if a list finds a loophole ("emergency stop" button)

4) a penalty for bringing duplicates of the same unit REGARDLESS of force org slot (i.e. running two Land raiders as Dedicated Transports and one as a Heavy)



I dunno, I really think the comp system we have tried in the last two events has worked out well, but i enjoy the brainstorming that comes as a result of these events.
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Re: Standish Standoff III

Postby tucara » Sun Nov 24, 2013 8:12 pm

It sounds like it would have been a fun time, but as most have seen my half painted, half-assembled army, I figured it would have bottomed out the painting score. It's also interesting to hear the stories of dickish list and players. I feel fortunate that Dorka was the first gaming group I found since it's populated by lots of easy-going folks who are really interested in playing and fluff and not 'powning n00bs'.
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Re: Standish Standoff III

Postby Thunderjaw » Sun Nov 24, 2013 8:25 pm

I love pwning noobs! And by noobs I mean Fred!

I also love Maine. And by Maine I mean Mooses and Standish.
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Re: Standish Standoff III

Postby Thor » Sun Nov 24, 2013 8:26 pm

Every year we plan this event comp is the subject of very heated debate, and rightfully so. It ranges from people wanting to just remove it entirely, some who want an entirely subjective system on a codex-by-codex basis and everything in between. While I love comp in theory, in practice I have never once seen it be a perfect system. Ultimately what ends up happening is the cool guys adhere to it because they appreciate the principle of it but then the douchebags worm their way into the event and abuse the shit out of it. Speaking of, I'm sorry for any of you who got stuck in those matches. 99% Of the guys up here are cool and love the hobby but that 1% comes out of the woodwork for our annual events. Fucking 1%'ers.

I agree with you all that allies is the most abusive element in 6th edition right now. It's not the only one of course but the most widely abused for sure. The bitch there is like the above mentioned comp, finding a system that fairly and equally regulates allies across the board. Maybe battle brother only restrictions would be a step in that direction. Possibly setting a percentage of your force that can be comprised of allies, IE: no more than 25% of your points can be spent on allies (example only as the % would be subject to game size). The ally abuse comes in so many forms that checklists don't cut it there.

Oh, I know who you're talking about, stormboy, and he's the reason Steve brought up a topic on our board about giving penalties to dick-move ally lists. His ally choices was cherry-picking at its finest (assuming I have the right person you're discussing - he had Tigerius, right?).

When the email gets sent for feedback please make sure you put this stuff in there, the good and bad. Copy and paste it from here if you want but send it along. If we get 30 emails saying they faced too many assholes abusing the system then when know something has to change.

Anyway, glad you guys came up and had a great time. It's awesome seeing you guys walk away with trophies. I know you make the drive just to circle through our round-abouts endlessly but getting rewarded for your time and effort is nice too.
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Re: Standish Standoff III

Postby stormboy » Sun Nov 24, 2013 8:27 pm

Allies is more than a Battle Brothers thing.

Tau and Marines are Battle Brothers for shit sake. Maybe Tau and Marines will fight together once and a while, but it feels like the rulebook made a mistake in that regard. I mean when Tigerius is throwing powers of the warp to support Tau... there is a problem. Sometimes you need to just ask if something makes sense and say "No, we don't want to see that combination." Or "Go ahead and bring 2 LandRaiders, but a third, regardless of difference, will result in an big giant no thank you."

I guess getting 40 people through the door is difficult... but wouldn't you have rather have 30 people and ensured all of the people enjoyed their entire day? I am realizing how valuable my time is worth, and my hobby counts for a lot of my free time, but when I feel like it has been wasted I get frustrated.

Another thing is the long day. I left my house at 5:30 and didn't get home until 1:00am. We were at Crossroads at 8:30 and the tourney didn't start until 9. We didn't leave the event until after 9pm. It felt like a ton of lost time. Can't the painting competition be done during the day while people are playing? Can we try to get finished by 8pm and out the door by 8:30?
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Re: Standish Standoff III

Postby Thor » Sun Nov 24, 2013 8:30 pm

Lucyth wrote:
TheRhino wrote:I'll post a longer response later, but the spring event will definitely be 1500 points.


THIS. I am definitely looking forward to this. Narrative Event? 1500? YES PLEASE.



If you're bored and want to see what we did this spring for Fratris Salutem, the event Todd is talking about, here's the packet, missions and the event's story conclusion to the day. It was probably the coolest thing I've ever organized. I never thought I would have so much fun watching a bunch of nerds play games but I did!

https://drive.google.com/folderview?id= ... sp=sharing
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Re: Standish Standoff III

Postby Hippie » Sun Nov 24, 2013 8:56 pm

stormboy wrote:Allies is more than a Battle Brothers thing.

Tau and Marines are Battle Brothers for shit sake. Maybe Tau and Marines will fight together once and a while, but it feels like the rulebook made a mistake in that regard. I mean when Tigerius is throwing powers of the warp to support Tau... there is a problem. Sometimes you need to just ask if something makes sense and say "No, we don't want to see that combination." Or "Go ahead and bring 2 LandRaiders, but a third, regardless of difference, will result in an big giant no thank you."

I guess getting 40 people through the door is difficult... but wouldn't you have rather have 30 people and ensured all of the people enjoyed their entire day? I am realizing how valuable my time is worth, and my hobby counts for a lot of my free time, but when I feel like it has been wasted I get frustrated.

Another thing is the long day. I left my house at 5:30 and didn't get home until 1:00am. We were at Crossroads at 8:30 and the tourney didn't start until 9. We didn't leave the event until after 9pm. It felt like a ton of lost time. Can't the painting competition be done during the day while people are playing? Can we try to get finished by 8pm and out the door by 8:30?


If it's any consolation Jack when we come down to the Eagles for your events I leave my house at 7am and get home around 1-1:30 am. I'm afraid it is just because you guys live in the sticks. :P

It sucks to hear after all the work I did that even one person had a bad game or even a bad moment. The comp system definitely was NOT built to fill 40 slots and had I not harassed you guys and other forums as well as emailed everyone we had in our address book we never would have sold 40 tickets.

I'm glad you came and hope you come in the Spring to our Story driven event.

I could go on and on here(because that's just the way I am) but I won't.

Glad you came, glad to see you guys, I had FUN(and isn't that all that matters?<sarcasm inserted>)

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